Jennifer is one of the best, if not the best, commentators on these issues.
It`s the coming generation that will feel the effects of these social engineering programs.
I believe most of the acceptance of these social views and programs are based on antagonism toward masculinity. The so-called “independance” and “empowerment” of women and same-sex coupling that many socialist programs espouse is just a replacement of the “traditional” male role with “big brother” government.
Government GIVES them independance, government GIVES them
empowerment....government is thier MAN.
This is why the radical Islamics, who take the male-female relationship to it`s most hideous extreme, are such a threat to the Western world, which devalues masculinity.
In evolutionary terms, they`re simply the stronger, more adaptive organism. Sad;because it doesn`t have to be that way.

By conflating gay partners with single parents, Ms Morse artificially lowers the numbers for gay parents. Examined alone, gay parents do as well as straight parents. Lesbian parents do a little bit better than either straight parents or gay male parents. But for all intents and purposes they are all equal. The people who make these tedious, tortured arguments against same sex parents ignore all the studies that disagree with them. Back in the ‘sixties’ the welfare of children was used over and over again to argue against interracial marriage. The children were the excuse for their opposition but prejudice was the reason. When it comes to opposition to same sex parents prejudice is still the reason, children are the excuse.

I’m afraid that David Page raises a serious charge against traditionalism.

Anyone who is surprised by anything probably hasn’t been paying close attention . .  .  Charles+

Hello David Page, Any comparison between interracial marriage etc., and “gay” is the most overused and pointless cliche in use.
What do you mean by how “gay”, lesbian and “straight” parents “do”? “gay” and lesbian parents may seem to “do” well because
they are still bolstered and raised in a “straight"," hetero normative” society. As close to a normal upbringing as they can get.
The true concern here is the effect on children and society when children are brought up to to actively question their
sexuality, their so-called “orientation” and even their gender (actually their sex).
As Dr. Morses` article indicates it`s all related to a war on masculinity. Equality of men and women does not mean sameness. Europe is one big “nanny state”;cradle-to-grave
in great cause, I believe, due to their mistaken sense of equality. Also their promotion of “gay” equality. In their view, sex has no importance. An emasculated and thus defeminized society cannot stand.
Such neutered individuals, or even small groups, can live well, provided they live in a protective society, but if masculinity and femininity are devalued, that society falls and or will be taken control of by a stronger society.  We cannot ignore long term effects because of short term lack of visible deficiencies.

Darren, I was afraid the day would pass without hearing from you. I’ve been in an interracial marriage for 40 years. I remember quite well what America was like back then and the justifications that were made against it. Despite the 1967 Loving verses Virginia Supreme Court ruling, in many States my marriage was illegal. South Carolina and Alabama didn’t remove Anti-miscegenation language from their Constitutions until about ten years ago. Bob Jones University didn’t allow interracial dating until Bush was embarrassed by their policy when he opened his 2000 campaign there. Of course gay marriage and interracial marriage are not the same, but there are enough similarities in the response to it to make the analogies relevant. In fact the opposition to gay marriage is far less vociferous than the opposition to interracial marriage. In the late ‘50s 95% of all Americans were against interracial marriage.

Darren said: “The true concern here is the effect on children and society when children are brought up to to actively question their sexuality, their so-called “orientation” and even their gender “

Children who grow up in gay households are no more likely to be gay than children who grow up in straight households. If your argument was correct then straight parents would never have gay children and all children of gay parents would be gay. The numbers just aren’t there to support your argument.

Darren said: “Such neutered individuals, or even small groups, can live well, provided they live in a protective society, but if masculinity and femininity are devalued, that society falls and or will be taken control of by a stronger society.”

I think you’ve fallen into the misconception that gay people are effeminate wimps. The author, Frank Herbert, once said that homosexuals were the most prized warriors in ancient times.
The number of Lesbians in the American armed services is estimated at close to 50% of female soldiers. Of course we can’t know for certain because of the persecution that exists there. The Israeli military has gay people completely integrated into the ranks. Do you think the Israeli army is weak? Their ‘masculine’ enemies certainly don’t think so.

Darren said: “Equality of men and women does not mean sameness.”

No Darren, it doesn’t mean sameness, but it means ‘sameness’ before the law.

Pointless, you say?  I submit to you that traditional society prohibited interracial marriages and thus liberal activist have been led to believe that interracial marriages go hand-in-hand with same-sex unions.  I submit to you that traditional societies valued absolute male dominance and absolute female subservience, thus provoking the so-called “war on masculinity”.

I mostly agree with Ms Roback Morse and I also find the trend worrisome, at least.
However, it should be noted that Québec has also put in place a very popular Parental leave system (http://www.naissance.info.gouv.qc.ca/en/fiche.asp?sujet=13 of which fathers take advantage at a rate of some 60%.
It constitutes, again at least, an acknowledgement of the importance of the father.
In particular, “Parental leave (up to 52 weeks) may be taken in addition to maternity leave or, in the case of the father, in addition to his five-week paternity leave.”

Gay marriage is a nonsense- since marriage has been established everywhere and in all societies, ever since time began to protest the children who are he natural result of heterosexual sex.
The political Gay marriage movement is a big game of let’s pretend, which has usurped the language of rights. And it all revolves around the sex itself.Instead of simply accepting their difference homosexuals have to pretend that their type of sex is the same as natural heterosexual sex.  Consequently,using ‘rights talk this complex game of lets pretend insists that homosexual sex and coupledom MUST have the same result - children. hence homosexual couples will go through all sorts of legal and biotec contortions to acquire that result.
On the subject of lesbian couples, there is indeed not much evidence that such relationships harm children and, yes indeed most gays are from normal straight families. However it should be remembered that this experiment has not has much time to take effect , and secondly MOST children of lesbians, like one couple I know, actually have fathers. It is not at all uncommon for lesbian women to have been married.

David Page wrote:
“Examined alone, gay parents do as well as straight parents. Lesbian parents do a little bit better than either straight parents or gay male parents. But for all intents and purposes they are all equal. The people who make these tedious, tortured arguments against same sex parents ignore all the studies that disagree with them.”

Unadulterated nonsense!
..... and deja vu David where might “all the studies that disagree” be?  Common sense seems to be ever so much in want in your argument.  It is also tiring to see you repeatedly conflate race issues and homosexual issues.

Jim said: “It is also tiring to see you repeatedly conflate race issues and homosexual issues.”

I’m comparing the reaction against gay marriage to the reaction against interracial marriage and it certainly seems the same to me. Gay and interracial marriage don’t have to be the same for me to recognize the striking similarities in the arguments of the people who oppose them. When I hear those arguments, it feels as bad and wrong as the racism which shaded my marriage forty years ago. Jim, you can use exclamation points until your keyboard breaks but gay rights is the civil rights movement of our time, and we will win.

Perhaps David Page knows of some unpublished studies.  But the evidence in the public domain indicates that, even in the eyes of gay marriage advocates, there are significant differences:

“Even a recent meta-analysis by two gay activists failed to support the “just like other children” myth. In 2004, Judith Stacey and Timothy J. Biblarz,(2) both supporters of gay parenting, published a study entitled, “(How) Does the Sexual Orientation of Parents Matter?” In it they re-examined twenty studies of same-sex parenting that had supposedly shown no difference, and charged their authors with ignoring the differences they had indeed found. There were differences: children raised by parents with SSA showed empathy for “social diversity”, were less confined by gender stereotypes, more likely to have confusion about gender identity, more likely to engage in sexual experimentation and promiscuity, and more likely to explore homosexual behaviour. Stacey and Biblarz characterized these as positive differences, suggesting that same-sex parenting may in fact be superior.”

(Findings summarized from Judith Stacey, Timothy J. Biblarz “(How) Does the Sexual Orientation of Parents Matter,” American Sociological Review, April 2004)

Redefining the goals of parenting so that earlier sexual experimentation and promiscuity are deemed as positive outcomes is certainly one strategy in evaluating the results but the results themselves are clear on the differences in the outcomes, even to gay activists.

Jim said: “It is also tiring to see you repeatedly conflate race issues and homosexual issues.”

I’m comparing the reaction against gay marriage to the reaction against interracial marriage and it certainly seems the same to me. Gay and interracial marriage don’t have to be the same for me to recognize the striking similarities in the arguments of the people who oppose them. When I hear those arguments, it feels as bad and wrong as the racism which shaded my marriage forty years ago.

The opposition to interracial marriage is not limited to
the USA or western societies. Opposition to any “mixed” marriage is not limited to race.
All societies, religions and thier various sects, tribes have had probitions of some level against “mixed” marriage.
It`s a human failing; “he/she is “from the wrong side of the tracks”, “high society” vs. “hicks”, India had the caste system, ye olde England had(has) royalty vs. commoners and on and on.
The MAIN, OVERWHELMING fear;reason;concern;objection was children of mixed heratige, race etc., thus watering down
one`s culture and such. Even street gangs and mafioso want “purity”.
There is ABSOLUTELY NO such possibility of this happening
with “gay marriage”. The comparison of objection to interracial marriage and “gay marriage” is total nonsense.
No society,group etc., good or bad, has ever approved or promoted homosexual behavior. It was,is and will always be obviously unnatural.